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WTF is wrong with the left?

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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3495 on: June 13, 2023, 06:25:19 PM »
Quote from: illiniray on June 13, 2023, 10:07:46 AM

If anyone read the Failing NY Times daily email, you'd see in their analysis of what Dems need to do to appeal to white working class voters in order to actually win elections, that Custard is closer to what working class voters want than Spark or Tempo.

Republicans have a similar problem. To actually win elections, they need to rile up their bigoted base and risk alienating moderates.

I just saw Paul Ryan on CBS, blah blah blah "I'm a never again Trumper because I want to win, and if he's the nominee we'll lose"

This is why we are so screwed. No candidates say "I want to implement this policy agenda and it will make our lives better", they say "I want to win". It's not football. *WHY* do you want to win? This current crop includes a lot of people who just "Want to win". Why the hell is George Santos even a Congressman? Does he have nuanced interest in policy?

Is Ryan implying he thinks Trump has perfect policy ideas he's just a nutball who causes too much trouble instead of selling the policy and so he loses and they don't get to implement policy?
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3496 on: June 13, 2023, 06:29:01 PM »
Quote from: Custard on June 13, 2023, 12:20:29 PM
White working class pays most of the taxes,

Do you have any math on that? I once did some back of the envelope calculation and showed that the Cubs pay more income taxes than the entire population of Logan and Grundy Counties combined. I don't mean the organization, just the players. And I don't mean the 40 man roster, the 24 man.
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spark mandrill

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3497 on: June 13, 2023, 06:32:53 PM »
Quote from: murphstahoe on June 13, 2023, 06:25:19 PM
I just saw Paul Ryan on CBS, blah blah blah "I'm a never again Trumper because I want to win, and if he's the nominee we'll lose"

This is why we are so screwed. No candidates say "I want to implement this policy agenda and it will make our lives better", they say "I want to win". It's not football. *WHY* do you want to win? This current crop includes a lot of people who just "Want to win". Why the hell is George Santos even a Congressman? Does he have nuanced interest in policy?

Is Ryan implying he thinks Trump has perfect policy ideas he's just a nutball who causes too much trouble instead of selling the policy and so he loses and they don't get to implement policy?

Because we have fostered an environment, especially in the right-wing media, where the result is that is what the voters want.

If you're truly undecided between Trump and another candidate, what are the odds that candidate is someone interested in getting into the weeds on policy?
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3498 on: June 13, 2023, 06:34:12 PM »
Quote from: alum74 on June 13, 2023, 02:25:37 PM
Direct cash payments are a non-starter for many.  I think that ship has sailed.  We need some “outside the box” thinking that would lead to a honest dialogue, create empathy and build support for repairing the damage.     
https://www.businessinsider.com/personal-finance/ways-pay-reparations-for-slavery-2021-5

Agreed. Investing money into areas that have high African American populations, with both tax incentives to get businesses to put working class jobs there, and money funneled into K-12 schools that have high AA populations, extending pre-k support and nutrition programs. If you have a decent school and a job waiting for you if you get out of school, and you don't take advantage of it, then that's your problem. Right now, that's not the case.

It's an easy sell - look, everyone has to pull themselves up by their bootstraps, but it turns out some people don't have bootstraps. So we're gonna put the bootstraps in place. Done.

The MAGAs fret that direct cash payments turn into a trip to Wokeisneyland. You can't take money already spent on fixing the HVAC system of a crumbling school or on new textbooks and spend it on booze and hookers.
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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3499 on: June 13, 2023, 06:34:23 PM »
Quote from: murphstahoe on June 13, 2023, 06:29:01 PM
Do you have any math on that? I once did some back of the envelope calculation and showed that the Cubs pay more income taxes than the entire population of Logan and Grundy Counties combined. I don't mean the organization, just the players. And I don't mean the 40 man roster, the 24 man.

Don't they only pay taxes on the 84 games played in Chicago (at home and as Comiskey)?
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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3500 on: June 13, 2023, 06:35:01 PM »
Quote from: spark mandrill on June 13, 2023, 06:06:48 PM
How about this, I'll try to refrain from using the word 'stupid' from now on.  That's probably a fair criticism.

But I'd sure like to see you try to call out when someone here says something openly bigoted with the same vigor you call me out.  It happens here like, quite a lot.

Sure. Let's give it a whirl.
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3501 on: June 13, 2023, 06:35:38 PM »
Quote from: ThePAMan on June 13, 2023, 03:24:33 PM
A lot of lives, and money, was spent to free the slaves, no? Just inquiring if you think those "costs" should be factored in at all.

Those costs should be borne by the dipwits who started a war to keep slavery running, instead of just freeing the slaves without cost.
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3502 on: June 13, 2023, 06:37:14 PM »
Quote from: ThePAMan on June 13, 2023, 03:51:01 PM
[2]While I did post that I was tepid in anticipating QAnon97's "rationale" behind his comment (and compared it to looking at a fatal car wreck), I have an inkling (which may be completely wrong) that 97 just posts stuff to troll

It's all he has left in his life after shorting Nvidia.
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3503 on: June 13, 2023, 06:39:53 PM »
Quote from: ThePAMan on June 13, 2023, 06:34:23 PM
Don't they only pay taxes on the 84 games played in Chicago (at home and as Comiskey)?

Interesting. How do the 84 games they play outside Chicago become exempt from Federal Income Tax?
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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3504 on: June 13, 2023, 06:42:57 PM »
Quote from: murphstahoe on June 13, 2023, 06:25:19 PM
Is Ryan implying he thinks Trump has perfect policy ideas he's just a nutball who causes too much trouble instead of selling the policy and so he loses and they don't get to implement policy?

Yes.

While we know there are those who like him just to "own the libs," can you deny that there are plenty of people who agree with his tax and immigration policies?
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Mark Carman: "The Whitlock!...Caleb Williams failed Wayne Whitlock." Been told I need to take my dick out my mouth so maybe I "wont [sic] sound like such a fucking faggot all the time[.]"

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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3505 on: June 13, 2023, 06:45:42 PM »
Quote from: murphstahoe on June 13, 2023, 06:39:53 PM
Interesting. How do the 84 games they play outside Chicago become exempt from Federal Income Tax?

Sorry, I thought you were referring to state taxes.

It is not 84 outside of Chicago. 162- 84 = 78. I thought pro athletes paid pro rata taxes to each state they play games in (aside from Texas and Florida).
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Mark Carman: "The Whitlock!...Caleb Williams failed Wayne Whitlock." Been told I need to take my dick out my mouth so maybe I "wont [sic] sound like such a fucking faggot all the time[.]"

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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3506 on: June 13, 2023, 06:46:42 PM »
Quote from: murphstahoe on June 13, 2023, 06:29:01 PM
Do you have any math on that? I once did some back of the envelope calculation and showed that the Cubs pay more income taxes than the entire population of Logan and Grundy Counties combined. I don't mean the organization, just the players. And I don't mean the 40 man roster, the 24 man.

He may also be including sales taxes.
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Mark Carman: "The Whitlock!...Caleb Williams failed Wayne Whitlock." Been told I need to take my dick out my mouth so maybe I "wont [sic] sound like such a fucking faggot all the time[.]"

Tempo: "PAMan is a pot stirrer and agent provocateur"
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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3507 on: June 13, 2023, 06:52:21 PM »
Quote from: murphstahoe on June 13, 2023, 06:35:38 PM
Those costs should be borne by the dipwits who started a war to keep slavery running, instead of just freeing the slaves without cost.

The one time I went to the African American Museum in DC a few years ago, it included an extensive "narrative" as to how the North benefitted economically from Southern slavery as well. For example, the Northern manufacturers had lower raw product costs due to lower labor costs for things like cotton, etc. I found it to be an interesting angle that I had not recalled viewing, especially in such depth, previously.
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Mark Carman: "The Whitlock!...Caleb Williams failed Wayne Whitlock." Been told I need to take my dick out my mouth so maybe I "wont [sic] sound like such a fucking faggot all the time[.]"

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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3508 on: June 13, 2023, 07:17:49 PM »
Quote from: ThePAMan on June 13, 2023, 06:46:42 PM
He may also be including sales taxes.
Now do property taxes
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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #3509 on: June 13, 2023, 07:57:27 PM »
Quote from: murphstahoe on June 13, 2023, 07:17:49 PM
Now do property taxes

Do the players rent or own in Illinois?
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Mark Carman: "The Whitlock!...Caleb Williams failed Wayne Whitlock." Been told I need to take my dick out my mouth so maybe I "wont [sic] sound like such a fucking faggot all the time[.]"

Tempo: "PAMan is a pot stirrer and agent provocateur"
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