* *

User

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

June 17, 2026, 01:07:18 AM

Login with username, password and session length

Recent

Stats

Members
  • Total Members: 142
  • Latest: Hal9000
Stats
  • Total Posts: 180416
  • Total Topics: 1496
  • Online Today: 375
  • Online Ever: 4316
  • (October 16, 2025, 04:40:42 PM)
Users Online
Users: 0
Guests: 216
Total: 216

« previous next »
Pages: 1 ... 37 38 [39] 40 41 ... 419   Go Down

THE JFC Thread!

  • 6279 Replies
  • 656173 Views

0 Members and 6 Guests are viewing this topic.

*

spark mandrill

  • *****
  • 4043
  • +312/-40
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #570 on: December 03, 2023, 05:43:17 PM »
Quote from: Tempo34 on December 03, 2023, 05:35:08 PM
Again, he’s had some unfortunate “help” in many of those 4th quarter outcomes.

Do you not see how you make an excuse for why literally every. single. time. Justin Fields plays poorly it wasn't his fault?

You've already decided that his first two years basically don't count - they were tanking.  So any acknowledgement of poor play in his first 27 starts or whatever, those don't count.  And now he's 'turned the corner', but he has a thumb injury so poor play now doesn't really count either - plus he got a game winning drive!

And this year, he had a WR drop a ball.  Another one fumbled.  The defense gave up points at the wrong time.  There is ALWAYS, every single time, an excuse.  Admittedly it reminds me a bit of how I used to debate during the end of the Weber era.  Well, he had a big time recruit de-commit!  It wasn't his fault Brian Carlwell crashed into that tree!  He can't make the jumpshots!  Always an excuse.

It's frustrating - is there ever a point where you acknowledge that the large majority of the data doesn't look super good for Justin Fields, and that he is largely accountable for that?  That to make a case to keep him, you basically have to cherry pick two games in a career where he's started more than 30?
Logged
*

Reacher

  • *****
  • 40187
  • +1080/-1068
  • You should see my passer rating
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #571 on: December 03, 2023, 07:36:40 PM »
Quote from: spark mandrill on December 03, 2023, 05:43:17 PM
Do you not see how you make an excuse for why literally every. single. time. Justin Fields plays poorly it wasn't his fault?

I never once said Justin is blameless. I said he’s had lots of help being bad.
Logged
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
*

Reacher

  • *****
  • 40187
  • +1080/-1068
  • You should see my passer rating
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #572 on: December 03, 2023, 07:38:18 PM »
So in your opinion he’s only had 2 good games? You’re the harshest critic this side of PAMan.
Logged
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
*

spark mandrill

  • *****
  • 4043
  • +312/-40
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #573 on: December 03, 2023, 08:06:20 PM »
I don't think he's had very many stretches of being good enough to hold onto him, given the opportunity to draft another QB high.

I think he's had more than 2 good games, but he has not had very many stretches of consistently good play.  There's a reason you point to those two games, obviously.

Here's his career game log: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/F/FielJu00/gamelog/

There's more than two good games on the list, but there's a whole lot more bad games than good ones on it too.  And there's simply never been a stretch where Fields was consistently good, through 34 starts.  That's a bad sign.  We've already done the "he's turned the corner" thing two separate times in his career, and he was bad this past weekend.
Logged
*

spark mandrill

  • *****
  • 4043
  • +312/-40
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #574 on: December 03, 2023, 08:10:18 PM »
Quote from: Tempo34 on December 03, 2023, 07:36:40 PM
I never once said Justin is blameless. I said he’s had lots of help being bad.

You have some excuse, 100% of the time, when someone criticizes Fields.  There's always some reason you can't accurately evaluate him, because someone else was the reason he played bad.

Most QBs, especially guys picked in the top half of the first round, don't drop into some ideal situation.  A lot of them still look better than Fields has so far.  At some point, it's at least worth considering whether it's not some confluence of external factors conspiring to make Fields look bad when he's really good, but maybe it's just that Fields isn't good enough.
Logged
*

Reacher

  • *****
  • 40187
  • +1080/-1068
  • You should see my passer rating
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #575 on: December 03, 2023, 08:17:40 PM »
Quote from: spark mandrill on December 03, 2023, 08:06:20 PM
I don't think he's had very many stretches of being good enough to hold onto him,

So I have heard.
Logged
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
*

Reacher

  • *****
  • 40187
  • +1080/-1068
  • You should see my passer rating
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #576 on: December 03, 2023, 08:22:42 PM »
Quote from: spark mandrill on December 03, 2023, 08:10:18 PM
You have some excuse, 100% of the time, when someone criticizes Fields.  There's always some reason you can't accurately evaluate him, because someone else was the reason he played bad.

Most QBs, especially guys picked in the top half of the first round, don't drop into some ideal situation.  A lot of them still look better than Fields has so far.  At some point, it's at least worth considering whether it's not some confluence of external factors conspiring to make Fields look bad when he's really good, but maybe it's just that Fields isn't good enough.

He’s been part of his problem. He also hasn’t had a lot of help. When did Tua all of a sudden become good? When he got Hill, Waddle, and McDaniel. They were regretting drafting him his first couple of years.

When did Allen make a jump? When he got Stephon Diggs. A top 5-7 WR.

When did Hurts make a jump? When he got AJ Brown and Devonta Smith.

Yes, Fields has had DJ, but he didn’t even have a healthy line (a line that couldn’t afford injuries) from the get-go this year. There were lots of moving parts. It’s only the last few weeks the team has gotten healthier and had a chance to play together. And guess what, it’s starting to look better.

Oh, and his OC is a bottom 5 OC in the league…
Logged
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
*

spark mandrill

  • *****
  • 4043
  • +312/-40
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #577 on: December 03, 2023, 08:23:00 PM »
Quote from: Tempo34 on December 03, 2023, 08:17:40 PM
So I have heard.

I mean, do you?

What's Fields' best, say, 6 game stretch as a pro?  Is it good enough?
Logged
*

Reacher

  • *****
  • 40187
  • +1080/-1068
  • You should see my passer rating
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #578 on: December 03, 2023, 08:28:01 PM »
No one wants to fault the supporting cast when the Bears literally had to play a Center who can’t snap the ball.
Logged
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
*

spark mandrill

  • *****
  • 4043
  • +312/-40
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #579 on: December 03, 2023, 08:32:28 PM »
Quote from: Tempo34 on December 03, 2023, 08:22:42 PM
He’s been part of his problem. He also hasn’t hasn’t had a lot of help. When did Tua all of a sudden become good? When he got Hill, Waddle, and McDaniel. They were regretting drafting him his first couple of years.

When did Allen make a jump? When he got Stephon Diggs. A top 5-7 WR.

When did Hurts make a jump? When he got AJ Brown and Devonta Smith.

Yes, Fields has had DJ, but he didn’t even have a healthy line (a line that couldn’t afford injuries) from the get-go this year. There were lots of moving parts. It’s only the last few weeks the team has gotten healthier and had a chance to play together. And guess what, it’s starting to look better.

Oh, and his OC is a bottom 5 OC in the league…

Hahahaha, what?  You say "when did this other QB make the jump? when they got him a top WR" a couple times, and then when it gets to Fields you're like "SURE they got him a top WR, but he didn't even have a perfectly healthy line!"?  Jesus man.  Maybe these dudes are right about you - your devotion to Fields is really odd.  If Josh Allen got Stefon Diggs and he still looked average or worse, I assume you'd be like - maybe he's just average?  But he didn't, he got Diggs and his production and consistency took a huge jump and he was an MVP candidate.  To state the obvious; if that had happened with Fields, we would not be having this conversation.

Fact is: the Bears front office went out last offseason and got Fields a top WR, spent a top-10 pick on an offensive lineman, and signed another veteran offensive lineman in free agency.  They have invested in the offense but it's still mediocre - in large part because the quarterback struggles when he has to throw the ball.

The last few weeks have been mostly the same old Bears offense, you're hyping this "turn-around" up like it's something it's not - especially on offense.
Logged
*

Reacher

  • *****
  • 40187
  • +1080/-1068
  • You should see my passer rating
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #580 on: December 03, 2023, 08:32:45 PM »
Quote from: spark mandrill on December 03, 2023, 08:23:00 PM
I mean, do you?

What's Fields' best, say, 6 game stretch as a pro?  Is it good enough?

I’ve seen very high highs. And some definite lows. I’ve also seen steady improvement. Is he a complete quarterback yet? No. I still have faith he can and will get there.
Logged
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
*

spark mandrill

  • *****
  • 4043
  • +312/-40
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #581 on: December 03, 2023, 08:33:37 PM »
Quote from: Tempo34 on December 03, 2023, 08:28:01 PM
No one wants to fault the supporting cast when the Bears literally had to play a Center who can’t snap the ball.

The center deserves the blame for that.

And Justin Fields deserves the blame when he plays poorl.

You're using the first thing to excuse the second thing.
Logged
*

Reacher

  • *****
  • 40187
  • +1080/-1068
  • You should see my passer rating
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #582 on: December 03, 2023, 08:35:59 PM »
Dude, their line was already marginal and they had to go an extended period without Braxton Jones, Tevin Jenkins, and Nate Davis. They literally played a Center who had the yips. And the OC isn’t in Mike McDaniel’s universe.
Logged
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
*

Reacher

  • *****
  • 40187
  • +1080/-1068
  • You should see my passer rating
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #583 on: December 03, 2023, 08:38:54 PM »
Jalen Hurts has elite weapons and a great offensive line. And coaches that know how to use him.
Logged
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
*

spark mandrill

  • *****
  • 4043
  • +312/-40
    • View Profile
Re: THE JFC Thread!
« Reply #584 on: December 03, 2023, 08:44:11 PM »
Quote from: Tempo34 on December 03, 2023, 08:32:45 PM
I’ve seen very high highs. And some definite lows. I’ve also seen steady improvement. Is he a complete quarterback yet? No. I still have faith he can and will get there.

So what's his best 6 game stretch?

Here's what I came up with:

Last year weeks 6-11:

62.14% completion.  160.5 YPG.  7.1% TD% (10 in 6 games), 2.8% INT% (4 in 6 games).  106.6 rushing yards and 1 rushing TD per game.  1.16 fumbles and 3.6 sacks per game.

That'd be good enough if the rushing yards are sustainable, which I suspect they aren't.  Those fumble and sack numbers will kill you but the offense was at least scoring points in this stretch.  This is probably it.

The next best stretch is probably the current stretch - ignoring the Minnesota half (even though I think that's silly, not sure how else to keep it to 6 full games) his current 6 game run looks like this:

64.5% completion.  218.8 YPG.  6.2% TD rate (11 in 6 games), 2.8% INT rate (5 in 6 games). 68.2 rushing yards and 0.16 rushing TD per game.  1 fumble and 3.5 sacks per game.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 37 38 [39] 40 41 ... 419   Go Up
« previous next »