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WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?

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ILLove1997

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #885 on: December 25, 2022, 08:02:57 PM »
Not surprised you buy cans of pre-made soup, the easiest thing on the planet to cook, and for which the prepared versions have a margin of like 50%

I'm not paying 5 bucks for a can of soup lol
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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #886 on: December 25, 2022, 08:03:54 PM »
"Queue jumpers. Finally, there are those Canadians who travel to the US for elective care. It is this category that some use to talk about in comparing the two systems. In Canada, it is possible to wait for elective (not emergent) surgery due to a shortage of physicians. (Canada has one of the highest median ages of OECD countries; the US physician shortage is about ten years behind (Research Shows Shortage of More than 100,000 Doctors by 2030).

It is estimated that approximately 5000 people a year come to the US for medical care under this category; out of millions of hospital visits in Canada each year.

This is almost always for faster care rather than better care. If you have an arthritic hip and need a replacement, you can jump the queue and get it done faster in the US. Some do.

This is a case of system arbitrage. In Canada, the medical system is rationed in time; in the US the system is rationed by money. If you have money, you can get to the front of the line.

On the whole, the Canadian system is both cheaper and more effective. Medical outcomes are consistently higher in Canada than in the US, except for cancer care, where the US tends to be among the best in the world."

If there is a Canadian doctor shortage,  that doesn't seem to make sense....oh...

https://www.fraserinstitute.org/studies/waiting-your-turn-wait-times-for-health-care-in-canada-2020#:~:text=The%20waiting%20time%20in%20this%20segment%20increased%20from%2010.8%20weeks,reasonable%E2%80%9D%20(7.8%20weeks).

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/fraser-institute-wait-times-medical

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/i-thought-i-might-die-at-home-canada-s-health-care-system-is-crumbling-experts-say-1.6036628
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ThePAMan

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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #888 on: December 25, 2022, 08:20:34 PM »
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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #889 on: December 25, 2022, 09:28:25 PM »
The financial post is generally factually accurate for a right of center publication, but their free market bias clearly shows here. Sorry, but the US spends almost 20% of gdp on healthcare. That is significantly more than Canada's just over 12%.
“Taking a trip? Where to?”  -“Wherever I end up, I guess. -“Man, I wish I was you." -Well, hang in there.”

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No one in Mn

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #890 on: December 26, 2022, 06:45:28 AM »
Canadians are not coming here for advanced healthcare. Americans are going to Canada for basic stuff and Asia for advanced.
I might argue that coming to the U.S. for superior cancer therapy is advanced healthcare.
 
« Last Edit: December 26, 2022, 07:13:12 AM by Mn »
Still hiding behind innuendo and practicing the art of omission.

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Reacher

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #891 on: December 26, 2022, 09:52:07 AM »
The US has the “best” healthcare in the world. It’s also one of the least accessible and the least affordable. Americans love to talk about “freedom,” and “freedom of choice.” How fucking free are you if you are unable or terrified to leave a job you hate because you’re afraid you’ll lose your healthcare? How fucking “free” is that person. The notion that your healthcare is tied to your job (if you’re lucky enough to get good healthcare to your job) is insanity. And I would argue not a high level of “freedom.” If someone can leave their job knowing they’ll still get quality healthcare, now that’s something I would call “freedom.”
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.

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Reacher

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #892 on: December 26, 2022, 09:52:37 AM »
Go fund me shouldn’t be a fucking health care plan. Not in today’s world.
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.

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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #893 on: December 26, 2022, 01:46:34 PM »
I might argue that coming to the U.S. for superior cancer therapy is advanced healthcare.

Yet 13,000 Americans year get medical visas to go to India a year, many for cancer treatments. The best is only better if you can afford it.
« Last Edit: December 26, 2022, 01:48:05 PM by illiniray »
“Taking a trip? Where to?”  -“Wherever I end up, I guess. -“Man, I wish I was you." -Well, hang in there.”

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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #894 on: December 26, 2022, 02:27:26 PM »
Even the great economic minds who advocated free markets admitted they have limits. Healthcare is one of the things that does not work in a free market, in part because it is simply way too expensive finance out-of-pocket for the vast majority. There are other more arcane reasons, but we don't even need to go there.

That is why we have a third party funding vehicle called health insurance. I could go through the whole fuvking history, but we don't have time. Third party itself create some anti-market issues; which  become an excuse for large deductibles and copay; which are really designed to discourage "overuse" of healthcare. You jerks over use routine healthcare unless you have to pay out of pocket!

The bigger problem with using insurance to finance healthcare is insurance is intended to finance risks, not needs. That is why catastrophic health insurance makes more financial sense.

Left to operate in a free market, insurers try to limit risk exposure. They deny coverage, add exclusion riders, charge extra premium, close pools, or cancel policies to avoid to covering people they deem uninsurable. This keeps their rates low and profits high.

The problem is this defeats the social purpose of having health insurance, since those who need it the most do not have it.

So state and federal governments come up with a hodgepodge of often redundant, contradictory, confusing, expensive regulations and subsidies to try and somehow make health insurance work.

It was probably close to 30 years ago some major insurance companies quietly assembled a work group of brokers, agents, and underwriters to figure out how to fix the mess. They had two ideas:

1. Tweak Medicare and expand it to cover everyone. Medicare for All. National health insurance.

2. Mandatory private health insurance with tax credit subsidies and tax penalty incentives.  Obamacare went this direction.

I gather nationalized healthcare was not seriously considered. I don't think there was any enthusiasm to privatize Medicare either. From what I recall agents were skeptical about flex spending and msa / has type plans.I liked the concepts of msa / hsa plans back then,  basically buy catastrophic and invest the difference. 
« Last Edit: December 26, 2022, 02:52:50 PM by illiniray »
“Taking a trip? Where to?”  -“Wherever I end up, I guess. -“Man, I wish I was you." -Well, hang in there.”

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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #895 on: December 26, 2022, 02:52:21 PM »
The notion that your healthcare is tied to your job (if you’re lucky enough to get good healthcare to your job) is insanity.

Blame FDR. Employers started offering health insurance as a way to get around WWII wage freezes.

If we banned health insurance, med mal insurance, and instituted tort reform, would health care costs go down?

****Maybe Nichi can opine.

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Reacher

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #896 on: December 26, 2022, 03:58:34 PM »
I (was) friends with a conservative Republican couple where the husband got cancer and was booted off insurance. They were mad that they were basically forced to go onto Obamacare, ironically not understanding that if not for Obamacare their option was *nothing.*
"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.

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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #897 on: December 26, 2022, 04:31:09 PM »
Blame FDR. Employers started offering health insurance as a way to get around WWII wage freezes.

If we banned health insurance, med mal insurance, and instituted tort reform, would health care costs go down?

****Maybe Nichi can opine.

Health insurance at work is better than nothing. Ditto Medicare. Take those away, only the wealthy could afford healthcare.

Healthcare as we know it for the elderly, middle class, and poor would vanish. Whatever was left would certainly cost less.

There would likely be a large increase in private charites opening free clinics.

Elimination of health insurance would pave the way for national healthcare -- VA for all. 
“Taking a trip? Where to?”  -“Wherever I end up, I guess. -“Man, I wish I was you." -Well, hang in there.”

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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #898 on: December 26, 2022, 04:44:38 PM »
It's like suggesting that college tuition would go down if we eliminated the student loan program and replaced it with nothing.
“Taking a trip? Where to?”  -“Wherever I end up, I guess. -“Man, I wish I was you." -Well, hang in there.”

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ThePAMan

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Re: WTF is wrong with Joe Biden today?
« Reply #899 on: December 26, 2022, 06:08:31 PM »
So Nichi says "No."
Mark Carman: "The Whitlock!...Caleb Williams failed Wayne Whitlock." Been told I need to take my dick out my mouth so maybe I "wont [sic] sound like such a fucking faggot all the time[.]"

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