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WTF is wrong with the left?

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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5760 on: August 23, 2024, 11:22:55 PM »
Quote from: Custard on August 23, 2024, 10:59:03 PM

Also remind me because I can’t remember…we don’t like Milton Friedman do we?

Friedman, like Hayek, had some good ideas.

Hayek was an advocate of social insurance.

As was Friedman. He liked the idea of a guaranteed income distributed as a reverse income tax, via refundable tax credits.

Richard Nixon damn near got a reverse income tax passed, but his fellow Republicans wanted too many conditions.
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5761 on: August 23, 2024, 11:27:58 PM »
Quote from: illiniray on August 23, 2024, 06:11:14 PM
Reagan ran massive deficits while inflation declined rapidly.

W. Bush funded a massive bail out with QE. Inflation remained low.

Donnie Trump presided over a huge stimulus and record deficits. Inflation remained low.

We had significant inflation twice my lifetime.

The inflation of the 1960's and 1970's was tied to the end of the gold standard, the  Arab Oil Embargo, the end wage of wage price controls, ...

The recent post pandemic inflation was a global event due to supply chain disruptions.

The recent inflation is bupkus compared to the 70's. It's just recency bias where things have just stayed cheap or gotten cheaper for decades.
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5762 on: August 23, 2024, 11:31:10 PM »
Quote from: Custard on August 23, 2024, 10:59:03 PM
The government pumped trillions into the economy just after shutting down segments of the economy, but the resulting worst inflation spike in 40 years was simply due to supply chain issues. Ok.

Deficit spending continues to get worse which isn’t something that can just go on forever.

When/where are we making the hard cuts?

Also remind me because I can’t remember…we don’t like Milton Friedman do we?

If the economy was shut down - reducing incomes, and the government replaces that lost money with printed money - it nets out even.

We already made cuts. Tax cuts. Which are the wrong kind of cuts. Elon Musk has 250 billion dollars, and the only trickling down he's done is to buy Twitter, which didn't trickle anything because he destroyed a viable business. OK, maybe it wasn't a viable business, but it was transferring wealth from shareholders to employees who spend money, now he laid them off and evaporated the value of the company. Frankly the government would have done a lot better work with that 40 billion
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alum74

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5763 on: August 23, 2024, 11:46:40 PM »
Quote from: Custard on August 23, 2024, 10:59:03 PM
When/where are we making the hard cuts?

Bellyaching about federal deficits is the easy part.  Why don't you tell us where you would make the "hard cuts"? 

One of my favorite pundits thinks we have three choices to rein in the deficits.  I tend to agree.  Here they are:

Take a blowtorch to Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and a few other smaller entitlement programs.

Or repeal the Bush and Trump tax cuts.

Or some combination of the above.

Now comes the hard part: finding a group of Democrats and Republicans that would be willing to work together to tackle the problem in a meaningful way.  I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon.

 

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Custard

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5764 on: August 23, 2024, 11:54:46 PM »
Quote from: murphstahoe on August 23, 2024, 11:31:10 PM
If the economy was shut down - reducing incomes, and the government replaces that lost money with printed money - it nets out even.

We already made cuts. Tax cuts. Which are the wrong kind of cuts. Elon Musk has 250 billion dollars, and the only trickling down he's done is to buy Twitter, which didn't trickle anything because he destroyed a viable business. OK, maybe it wasn't a viable business, but it was transferring wealth from shareholders to employees who spend money, now he laid them off and evaporated the value of the company. Frankly the government would have done a lot better work with that 40 billion

It didn’t net out even. They overshot it. It made up for the shutdown, then led to a situation where people who typically don’t have much cash had (relatively) a bunch of cash. Those people spent that money on supply constrained goods and services. It was gasoline on the supply chain fire.
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Custard

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5765 on: August 23, 2024, 11:56:19 PM »
Quote from: alum74 on August 23, 2024, 11:46:40 PM
Bellyaching about federal deficits is the easy part.  Why don't you tell us where you would make the "hard cuts"? 


This is why I ask the experts. Had a feeling the answer in these parts would be “give the government more taxpayer money” but wanted to be sure.
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Custard

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5766 on: August 24, 2024, 12:27:35 AM »
Quote from: illiniray on August 23, 2024, 11:16:48 PM
The bailouts of the S&L crisis and the mortgage crisis didn't seem to cause inflation.

Please explain how the government pumping money into our economy caused global inflation.

Supply chain disruptions were global?

The bailouts didn’t cause proper inflation per se, but they counteracted deflation in a major financial crisis. The opposite of deflation is inflation, so…

This time the bailouts and payouts overshot any kind of actual need, a lot of it went into the hands of families and small businesses and not big banks, so it was very quickly spent in an already voluntarily constrained supply chain. Too much money chasing too little supply is the core component of inflation, and it isn’t debatable.
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5767 on: August 24, 2024, 12:43:14 AM »
Quote from: Custard on August 23, 2024, 11:54:46 PM
It didn’t net out even. They overshot it. It made up for the shutdown, then led to a situation where people who typically don’t have much cash had (relatively) a bunch of cash. Those people spent that money on supply constrained goods and services. It was gasoline on the supply chain fire.

Those goldbrickers eating 50 eggs and jacking up the price of eggs! for shame!
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5768 on: August 24, 2024, 12:44:51 AM »
Quote from: Custard on August 23, 2024, 11:56:19 PM
This is why I ask the experts. Had a feeling the answer in these parts would be “give the government more taxpayer money” but wanted to be sure.

As an expert, I have a great idea. Stop paving the roads in your county, and cut the FEMA budget by making your county ineligible. Stop giving police and fire federal grants there too. How about shutter the post office in your area, use email.
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Custard

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5769 on: August 24, 2024, 12:58:34 AM »
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IlliniGolf

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5770 on: August 24, 2024, 01:22:03 AM »
Quote from: ThePAMan on August 23, 2024, 05:14:45 PM
Not one of your better efforts, Golf.

Sorry U didn’t get it Mr. They
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Reacher

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5771 on: August 24, 2024, 09:39:27 AM »
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"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
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Reacher

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5772 on: August 24, 2024, 09:46:40 AM »
Greedflation is playing a huge role in rocketing costs. Go to Twitter or Google and search stock buy backs. Grocery chains, restaurant chains, and other corporations are enriching themselves through manipulation. There’s a reason stock buy backs used to be illegal.
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"He commented more than once that, 'You know, Hitler did some good things, too,'" Kelly recalled to The Times. Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying "nothing (Hitler) did, you could argue, was good," but that Trump would occasionally bring up the topic again.
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alum74

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5773 on: August 24, 2024, 10:29:11 AM »
Quote from: Custard on August 23, 2024, 11:56:19 PM
This is why I ask the experts. Had a feeling the answer in these parts would be “give the government more taxpayer money” but wanted to be sure.

When you are a slave to a particular narrative, the answer to your problem will be more elusive, Grasshopper.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2024, 10:32:38 AM by alum74 »
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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #5774 on: August 24, 2024, 10:31:53 AM »
The Biden Administration is successfully enforcing section 2 of the Sherman Antitrust Act for the first time in 50 years.

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“Taking a trip? Where to?”  -“Wherever I end up, I guess. -“Man, I wish I was you." -Well, hang in there.”
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