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WTF is wrong with the left?

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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4665 on: March 06, 2024, 05:22:55 PM »
Quote from: Custard on March 06, 2024, 04:57:30 PM
The green folks want cleaner farming and renewable energy. The strategy? Take good farm ground out of production to put in wind turbines and solar panels. Meanwhile we don’t put solar panels on top of the Costco and Sam’s or in the parking lots of the giant new hospitals.

But we need to get rid of cow farts and fertilizer so the land we still have available to farm after the solar panels and wind turbines and urban sprawl is now significantly less productive than it was previously. Again, make it make sense.

Can agriculture be less polluting? For sure. Do we need ridiculous regulations like radical Europe is trying to shove down their throats? No. Should we be taking prime farmland out of production for decades for renewable energy when we have millions of acres of already developed land we could put turbines and solar panels on? Absolutely not. But the urban green NIMBY folks want them out in the country where they don’t have to look at them.

That good farm ground - 40% of it is used to produce ethanol to put in gas powered cars. The wind turbines produce more kilojoules of energy per year, and don't involve dumping NPK 10/10/10 onto the land, much of which runs off into the watershed. You don't have to combine the corn, take it to the elevator, put it on a train, haul it to a processing facility to make ethanol, then take the ethanol to a refinery to blend it into gasoline, then put the gasoline into trucks and haul that to the gas station. Farmers are putting in turbines because they make more money. It's so much more efficient that there would be no demand to exceed the 40% land currently used for ethanol. Don't worry, your cow isn't gonna starve.

But you knew that.

Every new parking lot around here, solar panels go on top. Aside from the energy produced, it's good for the vehicles. More panels being added to existing lots, houses, etc... plenty of incentives.
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alum74

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4666 on: March 06, 2024, 06:18:05 PM »
Quote from: Custard on March 06, 2024, 04:57:30 PM
FFS, yeah that’s a top priority. 🥴 I do have to wonder if there’s an agenda to re engineer our food production.

The green folks want cleaner farming and renewable energy. The strategy? Take good farm ground out of production to put in wind turbines and solar panels. Meanwhile we don’t put solar panels on top of the Costco and Sam’s or in the parking lots of the giant new hospitals.

But we need to get rid of cow farts and fertilizer so the land we still have available to farm after the solar panels and wind turbines and urban sprawl is now significantly less productive than it was previously. Again, make it make sense.

Can agriculture be less polluting? For sure. Do we need ridiculous regulations like radical Europe is trying to shove down their throats? No. Should we be taking prime farmland out of production for decades for renewable energy when we have millions of acres of already developed land we could put turbines and solar panels on? Absolutely not. But the urban green NIMBY folks want them out in the country where they don’t have to look at them.

Let’s pass a federal law that prohibits farmers from taking prime farmland out of production to sell to residential and commercial real estate developers.
https://www.agriculture.com/farm-management/farm-land/small-towns-trade-farmland-for-residential-development
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Somewhere in Mn

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4667 on: March 06, 2024, 06:33:07 PM »
Probably just the farmers selling their land instead of having to get a job in the cow tag production facility assembly line or learning to code.
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alum74

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4668 on: March 06, 2024, 06:34:26 PM »
Quote from: No one on March 06, 2024, 04:45:40 PM
Custard, here ya go ....
Everybody else ....... $15 million for cows.



Sounds like a good idea to ensure a rapid response when animal disease events take place.  Disease traceability programs have been around for years and they have support within the agricultural community.
https://texasfarmbureau.org/usda-proposes-updated-animal-disease-traceability-rule/
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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4669 on: March 06, 2024, 06:57:22 PM »
Quote from: alum74 on March 06, 2024, 06:34:26 PM
Sounds like a good idea to ensure a rapid response when animal disease events take place.  Disease traceability programs have been around for years and they have support within the agricultural community.
https://texasfarmbureau.org/usda-proposes-updated-animal-disease-traceability-rule/

Remember Alum - The first rule of Trumpism is that you hate everything the government might do. Unless it's writing you a check, unless someone else gets a check too.
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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4670 on: March 06, 2024, 07:06:45 PM »
The conventional system is a central power plant that distributes electricity from the point of production to the point of consumption. For ideological reasons, these are private sector, for practical reasons they are traditionally monopolies.

A number of years ago, competition of sorts was introduced. The traditional supplier still owns the distribution. However,  through customer choice plans, users can choose an electricity supplier.

FWIG, there are a couple ways green energy gets involved. The better way is to install the solar panels and or wind turbines at the point of consumption. Solar for residential and wind for commercial are starting to catch on, kind of.

The other way is via the wind and solar farms, sort of based on the central power plant model. They appear to market green energy via customer choice plans and also subscriptions.

The half baked sort of free market at work. Maybe we ought to socialize public utilities?


« Last Edit: March 06, 2024, 09:03:54 PM by illiniray »
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Somewhere in Mn

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4671 on: March 06, 2024, 07:14:18 PM »
The $15 million is for cows, not "animals".

And from the Farm Bureau guy ....
 
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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4672 on: March 06, 2024, 07:37:18 PM »
Maybe we should have central planning for the energy sector instead of a half baked free market?
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alum74

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4673 on: March 06, 2024, 07:58:33 PM »
Quote from: No one on March 06, 2024, 07:14:18 PM
The $15 million is for cows, not "animals".

And from the Farm Bureau guy ....
 

The $15 million is for cows and bison,  which are both subject to the Federal Animal Disease Traceability rules.
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Somewhere in Mn

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4674 on: March 06, 2024, 08:21:30 PM »
Quote from: alum74 on March 06, 2024, 07:58:33 PM
The $15 million is for cows and bison,  which are both subject to the Federal Animal Disease Traceability rules.
As they always have been.
You brought up the "animal disease events".
And mentioning cows and bison together is a clever way of hiding the targeting of the damn methane producers.
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alum74

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4675 on: March 06, 2024, 08:41:42 PM »
Quote from: No one on March 06, 2024, 08:21:30 PM
As they always have been.
You brought up the "animal disease events".
And mentioning cows and bison together is a clever way of hiding the targeting of the damn methane producers.

The $15 million is being allocated to help implement the Federal Animal Disease Traceability Rules.  Cows and bison are covered under these rules.

One of purposes of these rules is to "ensure a rapid response when animal disease events take place".
https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/ourfocus/animalhealth/SA_Traceability

There is nothing in these rules that cover or apply to methane production.

« Last Edit: March 06, 2024, 08:43:58 PM by alum74 »
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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4676 on: March 06, 2024, 09:02:12 PM »
Maybe diseases like foot in mouth, I mean hoof and mouth?
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Somewhere in Mn

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4677 on: March 06, 2024, 09:20:39 PM »
"including no less than $15,000,000 for electronic identification (EID) tags and related
infrastructure needed for stakeholders to comply with the proposed rule, "Use of Electronic
Identification Eartags as Official Identification in Cattle and Bison'' (88 FR 3320), should that
rule be finalized.


From 88 FR 3320, in black and white and paraphrased, if that's ok.
$15 million for ear tags for cattle and bison to comply with a proposed rule, should that rule be finalized.
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alum74

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4678 on: March 06, 2024, 09:31:43 PM »
Quote from: No one on March 06, 2024, 09:20:39 PM
"including no less than $15,000,000 for electronic identification (EID) tags and related
infrastructure needed for stakeholders to comply with the proposed rule, "Use of Electronic
Identification Eartags as Official Identification in Cattle and Bison'' (88 FR 3320), should that
rule be finalized.


From 88 FR 3320, in black and white and paraphrased, if that's ok.
$15 million for ear tags for cattle and bison to comply with a proposed rule, should that rule be finalized.

Soooo...what does any of that have to do with methane? 

Once again, the money is being allocated to help implement the Federal Animal Disease Traceability Rules, which are apparently being updated.

These rules have nothing to do with methane production.
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Somewhere in Mn

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Re: WTF is wrong with the left?
« Reply #4679 on: March 06, 2024, 09:57:57 PM »
Quote from: alum74 on March 06, 2024, 09:31:43 PM
Soooo...what does any of that have to do with methane? 

Once again, the money is being allocated to help implement the Federal Animal Disease Traceability Rules, which are apparently being updated.

These rules have nothing to do with methane production.
If only there was a link to google for cows and methane.

And the methane mention was a joking comment resulting from the Green New Deal.

"The “Green New Deal,” unveiled Thursday, sets sky-high goals to cut greenhouse gases to nearly zilch — but it’s not committed to getting rid of “farting cows” just yet.

That’s according to an initial outline of the ambitious new resolution put forward by freshman Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, D-N.Y., and Sen. Edward Markey, D-Mass., ......"
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