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WTF is wrong with Minnesota?

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illiniray and 4 Guests are viewing this topic.

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Reacher

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“Horde as much money as you can. No amount is too much. The Kingdom of Heaven belongs to the hoarders. Also, let me see your papers, bitch.” - Jesus of Nazareth

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Custard

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #586 on: January 12, 2026, 01:53:18 PM »
So.shut up and get in the kitchen?

I tried really hard to see this through your lens, but I’m completely back to FAFO.
Poster Boy for White Male Indifference

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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #587 on: January 12, 2026, 01:54:25 PM »
Sure he was.
He joined up 10 years ago just waiting for the right opportunity. When he was dragged 100 yards, or whatever, last summer he probably thought about shooting the whole time but decided to wait for a better opportunity.

He got his own self dragged. How has this ICE agent not darwin'd himself already, I have no idea.

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #588 on: January 12, 2026, 01:55:07 PM »
I tried really hard to see this through your lens, but I’m completely back to FAFO.

https://x.com/i/status/2010389073677181159
“Horde as much money as you can. No amount is too much. The Kingdom of Heaven belongs to the hoarders. Also, let me see your papers, bitch.” - Jesus of Nazareth

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Reacher

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #589 on: January 12, 2026, 02:24:36 PM »
ICE arrests 17 year old U.S. citizen working at Target, basically rough him up, drop him off 8 minutes away in the cold (to walk back?).

ICE

https://x.com/furkangozukara/status/2010666047201010014?s=46&t=taZJ_d5ITWr6Hq3PUZDUiQ

« Last Edit: January 12, 2026, 02:26:08 PM by Three Card MNte »
“Horde as much money as you can. No amount is too much. The Kingdom of Heaven belongs to the hoarders. Also, let me see your papers, bitch.” - Jesus of Nazareth

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #590 on: January 12, 2026, 02:33:34 PM »
This guy has an honest question for MAGA conservatives

https://x.com/dittiepe/status/2010664417994874968?s=46&t=taZJ_d5ITWr6Hq3PUZDUiQ
“Horde as much money as you can. No amount is too much. The Kingdom of Heaven belongs to the hoarders. Also, let me see your papers, bitch.” - Jesus of Nazareth

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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #591 on: January 12, 2026, 02:40:31 PM »
ICE arrests 17 year old U.S. citizen working at Target, basically rough him up, drop him off 8 minutes away in the cold (to walk back?).

ICE

https://x.com/furkangozukara/status/2010666047201010014?s=46&t=taZJ_d5ITWr6Hq3PUZDUiQ

This sort of thing has happened multiple times.
"I would build a great wall, and nobody builds walls better than me, believe me, and I’ll build them very inexpensively. I will build a great great wall on our southern border and I’ll have Mexico pay for that wall." -- Donald Trump

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #592 on: January 12, 2026, 02:43:58 PM »
I have no doubt. Hundreds or more I’d think.
“Horde as much money as you can. No amount is too much. The Kingdom of Heaven belongs to the hoarders. Also, let me see your papers, bitch.” - Jesus of Nazareth

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illiniray

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #593 on: January 12, 2026, 04:22:17 PM »
Supposedly from a lawyer. Interesting:

There seems to be a lot of Keyboard attorneys.online today. So, as an actual attorney, I'd like to cite actual law. The ICE officer in MN violated both protocol and case law.

1) officers are not allowed to fire into a moving vehicle
2) lethal force is not allowed to prevent someone from fleeing
3) case law is clear, an officer cannot intentionally place himself in front of a vehicle and then allege self defense

At best, this officer acted with a reckless disregard for public safety and is guilty of negligent homicide.

Federal agents do not have blanket immunity from state laws or criminal prosecution. They can be prosecuted by state authorities for violating state laws if their actions were unauthorized, unlawful, or unreasonable, even if they were on duty.

The concept governing this is called Supremacy Clause immunity. Federal agents are generally immune from state prosecution only if their actions were:bAuthorized under federal law; and
"Necessary and proper" to fulfill their federal duties.

If a federal agent is charged in state court, they can petition to have their case "removed" to federal court. In federal court, the judge would then determine whether the agent's actions met the "necessary and proper" standard.

If the court finds the agent was acting within the reasonable confines of their duties, the state charges will be dismissed.

If not, the state prosecution can proceed in federal court, applying state substantive law. It is unlikely any judge would find his behavior necessary and reasonable. The mere fact that no other officer present unholstered their weapon and appear shocked he fired towards them reinforces that fact.

Estate of Starks v. Enyart, 5 F.3d 230 (7th Cir. 1993) Seventh Circuit – foundational case facts: Officer stepped in front of a slowly moving vehicle and then shot the driver, claiming fear for his life. Holding (paraphrased) “An officer may not unreasonably create a physically threatening situation and then use deadly force to escape it.”

Adams v. Speers, 473 F.3d 989 (9th Cir. 2007) Ninth Circuit Facts: Officer jumped in front of a vehicle during a stop and then fired. Holding: An officer cannot provoke a confrontation and then rely on the danger they created to justify deadly force. Key language: The court emphasized that reasonableness includes the officer’s own tactical decisions leading up to the shooting.

Thompson v. Hubbard, 257 F.3d 896 (8th Cir. 2001) Eighth Circuit Key point: The court rejected summary judgment for officers where evidence showed the officer moved into the vehicle’s path, creating the perceived threat.

Abraham v. Raso, 183 F.3d 279 (3d Cir. 1999)
Third Circuit Facts: Off-duty officer shot a fleeing driver. Holding: The court stressed that pre-seizure conduct matters and that officers cannot rely solely on the “split second” framing if their own actions escalated the situation.
 
Kirby v. Duva, 530 F.3d 475 (6th Cir. 2008)
Holding: Deadly force may be unconstitutional where:
-The officer fired into a moving vehicle
-The officer could have stepped aside
-The threat was self-created
The Sixth Circuit explicitly rejected the idea that a moving car automatically justifies gunfire.

Adams v. Speers, 473 F.3d 989 (9th Cir. 2007) Holding: An officer may not intentionally place himself in danger and then use deadly force to neutralize the danger he created — including firing into a vehicle. The Ninth Circuit emphasized tactical disengagement as the constitutional expectation.

Training & Policy Alignment (Courts Care About This) Many courts note that modern police training instructs:
-Do not fire into moving vehicles
-Do not use deadly force to stop a fleeing car
-Disengage and contain instead
Courts treat violations of training as evidence of unreasonableness, even if not dispositive.

Copied and pasted.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2026, 04:27:04 PM by illiniray »
"I would build a great wall, and nobody builds walls better than me, believe me, and I’ll build them very inexpensively. I will build a great great wall on our southern border and I’ll have Mexico pay for that wall." -- Donald Trump

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #594 on: January 12, 2026, 04:42:26 PM »
“Fucking bitch.”
“Horde as much money as you can. No amount is too much. The Kingdom of Heaven belongs to the hoarders. Also, let me see your papers, bitch.” - Jesus of Nazareth

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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #595 on: January 12, 2026, 04:57:33 PM »
Supposedly from a lawyer. Interesting:

There seems to be a lot of Keyboard attorneys.online today. So, as an actual attorney, I'd like to cite actual law. The ICE officer in MN violated both protocol and case law.

1) officers are not allowed to fire into a moving vehicle
2) lethal force is not allowed to prevent someone from fleeing
3) case law is clear, an officer cannot intentionally place himself in front of a vehicle and then allege self defense

At best, this officer acted with a reckless disregard for public safety and is guilty of negligent homicide.

Federal agents do not have blanket immunity from state laws or criminal prosecution. They can be prosecuted by state authorities for violating state laws if their actions were unauthorized, unlawful, or unreasonable, even if they were on duty.

There are 2 kinds of people in the US. People who want to know what the law is, and people who think they know what the law is, and usually their mindset for thinking they know what the law is, comes from their experience in the school playground or badly formed movies from the 50's and 60's.

FOX and Trump have realized how easy it is to manipulate the latter group. They really do a disservice to the country by not pointing out this very clear stuff you posted here Nichi. The country was founded on a healthy distrust of authority, that created checks on said authority. That's been thrown out the window.

If you ask me, JB Pritzker should get the state assembly to pass a law with draconian penalties for drunk driving - one year driver's license suspension with no dispensation for work, jail time if there is any property damage or injury, and on 2nd offense or if someone with a suspension is found driving.

Then fire up a huge Illinois State Patrol presence to very strictly enforce drunk driving. Make random checks on people known to have suspended licenses, check their work places, the bars they are known to frequent.

That would learn a lot of MAGAs real fast about government overreach, er I mean it would save a lot of lives!

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Reacher

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #596 on: January 12, 2026, 05:04:25 PM »
Dunning-Kruger effect.
“Horde as much money as you can. No amount is too much. The Kingdom of Heaven belongs to the hoarders. Also, let me see your papers, bitch.” - Jesus of Nazareth

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murphstahoe

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #597 on: January 13, 2026, 12:00:53 AM »
These videos are getting worse, modulo no new fatalities.

Trump has turned this place into a banana republic. Brutal.

17 year old kid working pushing carts at target, just randomly grabbed by a bunch of goons, thrown in a van, beaten up, then chucked out of the van when they pretty much figured out "oh well, seems like the guy is a citizen after all".

What bullshit.

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Somewhere in Mn

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #598 on: January 13, 2026, 05:57:28 AM »
A front page headline in today's fishwrap:

Iranians are open to talks with U.S.

The front page also includes articles concerning Minnesota government officials being open to talks regarding cooperation between state and federal law enforcement.
Just kidding. There aren't any of these.
"Humans are stupid."

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Somewhere in Mn

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Re: WTF is wrong with Minnesota?
« Reply #599 on: January 13, 2026, 06:40:44 AM »
Supposedly from a lawyer. Interesting:

There seems to be a lot of Keyboard attorneys.online today. So, as an actual attorney, I'd like to cite actual law. The ICE officer in MN violated both protocol and case law.

1) officers are not allowed to fire into a moving vehicle
2) lethal force is not allowed to prevent someone from fleeing
3) case law is clear, an officer cannot intentionally place himself in front of a vehicle and then allege self defense

At best, this officer acted with a reckless disregard for public safety and is guilty of negligent homicide.

Federal agents do not have blanket immunity from state laws or criminal prosecution. They can be prosecuted by state authorities for violating state laws if their actions were unauthorized, unlawful, or unreasonable, even if they were on duty.

The concept governing this is called Supremacy Clause immunity. Federal agents are generally immune from state prosecution only if their actions were:bAuthorized under federal law; and
"Necessary and proper" to fulfill their federal duties.

If a federal agent is charged in state court, they can petition to have their case "removed" to federal court. In federal court, the judge would then determine whether the agent's actions met the "necessary and proper" standard.

If the court finds the agent was acting within the reasonable confines of their duties, the state charges will be dismissed.

If not, the state prosecution can proceed in federal court, applying state substantive law. It is unlikely any judge would find his behavior necessary and reasonable. The mere fact that no other officer present unholstered their weapon and appear shocked he fired towards them reinforces that fact.

Estate of Starks v. Enyart, 5 F.3d 230 (7th Cir. 1993) Seventh Circuit – foundational case facts: Officer stepped in front of a slowly moving vehicle and then shot the driver, claiming fear for his life. Holding (paraphrased) “An officer may not unreasonably create a physically threatening situation and then use deadly force to escape it.”

Adams v. Speers, 473 F.3d 989 (9th Cir. 2007) Ninth Circuit Facts: Officer jumped in front of a vehicle during a stop and then fired. Holding: An officer cannot provoke a confrontation and then rely on the danger they created to justify deadly force. Key language: The court emphasized that reasonableness includes the officer’s own tactical decisions leading up to the shooting.

Thompson v. Hubbard, 257 F.3d 896 (8th Cir. 2001) Eighth Circuit Key point: The court rejected summary judgment for officers where evidence showed the officer moved into the vehicle’s path, creating the perceived threat.

Abraham v. Raso, 183 F.3d 279 (3d Cir. 1999)
Third Circuit Facts: Off-duty officer shot a fleeing driver. Holding: The court stressed that pre-seizure conduct matters and that officers cannot rely solely on the “split second” framing if their own actions escalated the situation.
 
Kirby v. Duva, 530 F.3d 475 (6th Cir. 2008)
Holding: Deadly force may be unconstitutional where:
-The officer fired into a moving vehicle
-The officer could have stepped aside
-The threat was self-created
The Sixth Circuit explicitly rejected the idea that a moving car automatically justifies gunfire.

Adams v. Speers, 473 F.3d 989 (9th Cir. 2007) Holding: An officer may not intentionally place himself in danger and then use deadly force to neutralize the danger he created — including firing into a vehicle. The Ninth Circuit emphasized tactical disengagement as the constitutional expectation.

Training & Policy Alignment (Courts Care About This) Many courts note that modern police training instructs:
-Do not fire into moving vehicles
-Do not use deadly force to stop a fleeing car
-Disengage and contain instead
Courts treat violations of training as evidence of unreasonableness, even if not dispositive.

Copied and pasted.
Kirby v Duva is addressed in a different case that went to SCOTUS and SCOTUS writes ....

"In Estate of Kirby v. Duva, 530 F.3d 475, 482 (6th Cir. 2008),
cited to by respondents, the Sixth Circuit held summary judgment
was improper as triable issues of fact existed regarding whether
the officers reasonably believed they were in danger
prior to
shooting the decedent, which is not an issue here, as the trier of
fact specifically found the officers reasonably feared for their
safety. (App.108a.)"

In Kirby v Duva at the lower level, ballistics and physical evidence appeared to infer that the officers were not in danger.
This is what SCOTUS brought up.

I'm not sure what the lawyer accomplished by mentioning his/her view on the holdings in Kirby v Duva

The SCOTUS mention of Kirby v Duvav in .....
COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES,
DEPUTY CHRISTOPHER CONLEY
and DEPUTY JENNIFER PEDERSON,
 Petitioners,
–v–
ANGEL MENDEZ and JENNIFER LYNN GARCIA,
« Last Edit: January 13, 2026, 06:42:57 AM by No one in Mn »
"Humans are stupid."